New Wildcats now have tankless water heater

by VRUNNER on 2/26/2011, 10:21 am

I just came back from the AC RV show and saw the new Wildcats which are very nice. The one feature I was in love with is the tankless water heater. It is in the same spot the tank is in. In speaking to the dealer he said I could swap out the existing tank for the new tankless system. Anyone else see this yet or have it done?

by Scruffy and Tater on 2/26/2011, 10:41 am

Is that tankless water heater both propane and electric? If it's propane, why should I pay for propane when electric is free in most campgrounds? If I run out of propane I guess I wouldn't have hot water. It might be nice for someone who is boondocking - which quite a few of us do. We don't. Is that a standard feature? Is the old conventional water heater available as an option?

Tater

by Mopar_Earl on 2/26/2011, 12:26 pm

This was talked about in great detail here http://www.wildcatcamperforum.com/t3285-girard-tankless-water-heater

Earl

by Mopar_Earl on 2/26/2011, 12:39 pm

Scruffy and Tater wrote:Is that tankless water heater both propane and electric? If it's propane, why should I pay for propane when electric is free in most campgrounds? If I run out of propane I guess I wouldn't have hot water. It might be nice for someone who is boondocking - which quite a few of us do. We don't. Is that a standard feature? Is the old conventional water heater available as an option?

Tater

I'm in your boat. I only use propane with the electric while showering. Other wise I heat the water electric only unless boondocking.

The tankless is now standard and I've seen no option for the tanked heater.

Earl

by Scruffy and Tater on 2/26/2011, 1:23 pm

Just another reason to keep our 2007.

Tater

by Sean on 2/26/2011, 8:16 pm

When its time to change my Cat I would have to look at a make that gave the the water tank option.
Sean

by AVid on 2/27/2011, 7:54 am

We always run our water heater on electric. Not being able to do that would be a deal breaker for me. I'm with Tater on this.

John

by Carpe Diem on 2/27/2011, 9:00 am

Same here! I can count on a couple of fingers the times I have used the propane feature to recover for a shower. I use the electric side almost exclusively. Like others have said.....when I am hooked up to shore power, why would I want to use propane. Looks like I might be keeping mine for a while too. Looks like something that may not have been researched very well with the majority of users. I am sure this unit has its positive's......just not for my average use.

by Portagie1968 on 2/28/2011, 6:06 am

I use propane as recovery only when at an RV Park except during the summer months. AC, Micro and water heater to much. The other concern I would have is dry camping. The extra water a tankless uses.

by VRUNNER on 3/1/2011, 6:46 am

Thanks for the info. My trailer is a seasonal and we pay for electric. I found the propane is more cost effective at least for me. I did find the company that sells the unit so I am getting a price to have it put in. Thanks again!!

by jrnert on 3/10/2011, 11:21 am

Reading the comments on this chat room, there is some misinformation on Girard Tankless Water Heater.
Most of it is from speculation (from those who have not used it) on how it works and its' consumption of LP Gas.
Also, that it is not pratical for dry camping and is not pratical if you have "free" electric.
Yes, there is a learning curve with the Girard but like all new products/technology you have a learning curve.
Please note:
1. A Gas/Electric Tank Water Heater usually uses both energy sources. The gas or gas/electric are used for the recovery of temperature and then the electric is used to maintain the temperature 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, 365 days a year. Tank Water Heaters maintain a sotred hot water temperature of 130 - 140 degrees so when they go into recovery mode they need to heat to that temperature range.
2. The Girard Tankless Water Heater will heat only the Hot Water that is needed (Useable Hot Water). No recovery and maintaining the temperature like a tank of water and no worry about running out of Hot Water. The Girard does not need to heat water to 130 - 140 degrees since it does not need mix with cold water to make the 6 - 10 gallons of hot water last. By the way, if you don't need to mix hot and cold water together, to get the desired hot water temperature, the total volume of water used will be less (a good thing for dry camping).
A little math on LP Gas:
· There are 92,000 BTUs/per hour in a gallon of LP Gas.
· The Girard Tankless Water Heater will operate at 34,000 or 27,000 BTUs per hour depending on the incoming cold water temperature.
· So, with the Girard Tankless Water Heater 1 gallon of LP Gas will provide the camper with over 2.7 hours of ”Usable” Hot Water at 34,000 BTUs or over 3.4 hours of “Useable” Hot Water at 27,000 BTUs.
· A camper can easily figure how much time/demand for Hot Water they actually use a day.
· FYI – Wildcats have 2 – 30# LP Gas Tanks (7.09 gallons per tank) which provides a total of 14.18 gallons of LP Gas.

I hope this helps to clarify a few things regarding the Girard Tankless Water Heater.

by VRUNNER on 3/12/2011, 4:40 pm

good info!!

by kcnielsen on 3/12/2011, 6:06 pm

By the way, if you don't need to mix hot and cold water together, to get the desired hot water temperature, the total volume of water used will be less (a good thing for dry camping).

I don't agree with the above statement. When mixing cold with hot I'm using less of the hot water since the pump is limited to its maximum rate. My problem with the tankless is having to vary the flowrate in order to adjust the temperature. DW likes her shower to be quite hot with maximum pressure - I don't. We shower one after the other and have never run out of hot water. We have the 10 gal tank.

by jrnert on 3/13/2011, 12:32 am

kcnielsen:
You may be using less "hot water" but you say you are using max flow rate so total water volume would be more.
The adjustment of flow for temps on the Girard are minimal (not a trickle to full flow).
Thanks for your input and I'm glad you are happy with your 10 gallon tank model.

by Wight on 3/18/2011, 4:04 am

I have a 2011 wildcat and my water heater has a tank. I read above that someone thought they were standard. Not the case with me.

by Portagie1968 on 3/18/2011, 4:54 am

Wondering how much water you waste with a Tankless. I have one in the house and it does waste a little more than the Tank. Fuel used is less but water used is a little more. I have a old home that does not have a recirculating system which how the RV would be.

by jrnert on 3/18/2011, 9:45 am

Wasting water is no more with a tankless water heater than a tank water heater (once you understand the operation and become comfortable with it).
Remember, you are at the mercy of the plumbing system and the location of the fauctets/fixtures in relation to the location of the water heater....you have to evacuate the water present in the water line before you receive hot water....recirculating hot water in an RV plumbing system makes no sense since you have to have some type of power for the recirculating pump.
Remeber the flow rate of an RV (Gallons per Minute - GPM) is a lot less than people think....it is no where near 2 GPM but rather somewhere between 1 GPM - 1.5 GPM depending on the faucet/fixture. This is true whether using the pump/fresh water tank or a city/shore water source.

by Portagie1968 on 3/18/2011, 11:06 am

Trust me you do waste more water. Not much but you do. I have a tankless in the house and I do waste a little more water.

by Mopar_Earl on 3/18/2011, 4:48 pm

Wight wrote:I have a 2011 wildcat and my water heater has a tank. I read above that someone thought they were standard. Not the case with me.

You probably have a early 2011, check your build date.

Earl

by kcnielsen on 3/18/2011, 5:15 pm

jrnert, no matter how many times you try to defend the tankless water heater after someone makes a negative comment about it, I will not be convinced it is better or saves water or propane. We will have to wait and see how long it will take for the manufactures to abandon it.

by jrnert on 3/19/2011, 4:17 am

Ken,

I appreciate your opinion and your preference for a tank water heater but tankless technology is here and it is not going anywhere.
We're just catching up to the rest of the world where they have been using tankless water heaters sucessfully for years.

Regards - Jrnert

by Scruffy and Tater on 3/19/2011, 6:38 am

I guess this is a case of "different strokes for different folks." I think the tankless water heater is great for some people. I wish the new Cats would have optional water heaters, that way everyone could be happy. Is there such a thing as a gas/electric tankless water heater?

We are thinking about putting in an on-demand system for our house, but first we have to get gas - our neighborhood is all electric, except for a few people who have propane.

Tater

by Wight on 3/19/2011, 11:06 am

Mopar_Earl wrote:
Wight wrote:I have a 2011 wildcat and my water heater has a tank. I read above that someone thought they were standard. Not the case with me.

You probably have a early 2011, check your build date.

Earl

July 2010. I suppose it is early.

by Portagie1968 on 3/19/2011, 12:53 pm

I agree Tater. RV park they are great. Dry camping you need to figure the little amount of water U waste into the equation.

by c04678 on 4/7/2011, 5:16 am

jrnert, I took my 2011 Wildcat in for warranty work on the tankless water heater. Was told that it is functioning properly. How can I adjust the water temp, when there is no flow control on the standard water pump. We like very hot water and the way to get hot water is to lower the flow. The problem with that is the water pump will start to rapid cycle and this causes the water to exceed the temperature limit and it then blasts you with cold water. My wish is for Girard to replace the standard pump with a pump that you can vary the water flow without the rapid cycling. This should be a improvement for those who dry dock. I am going to give the tankless system one more try this weekend, and if it is still a pain in the behind to work with, then I will have it replaced with a tank model.

by Mopar_Earl on 4/7/2011, 5:27 am

c04678 wrote:jrnert, I took my 2011 Wildcat in for warranty work on the tankless water heater. Was told that it is functioning properly. How can I adjust the water temp, when there is no flow control on the standard water pump. We like very hot water and the way to get hot water is to lower the flow. The problem with that is the water pump will start to rapid cycle and this causes the water to exceed the temperature limit and it then blasts you with cold water. My wish is for Girard to replace the standard pump with a pump that you can vary the water flow without the rapid cycling. This should be a improvement for those who dry dock. I am going to give the tankless system one more try this weekend, and if it is still a pain in the behind to work with, then I will have it replaced with a tank model.

Maybe a bladder tank will help? It should smooth out the pump.

Earl

by c04678 on 4/7/2011, 5:40 am

Earl, that is something for me to check into, but should people who just spent quite a bit of money on a high dollar camper really need to modify their plumbing system just to get steady hot water when they want it.

by jrnert on 4/7/2011, 6:34 am

Dear CO4678,

Please call Girard Products Technical Department at 866-559-1221. or email me at jrennert@girardrv.com with your contact information.
I would like to talk to you and get some more information on your issues.

Thanks

by Portagie1968 on 4/7/2011, 7:31 am

c04678 wrote:jrnert, I took my 2011 Wildcat in for warranty work on the tankless water heater. Was told that it is functioning properly. How can I adjust the water temp, when there is no flow control on the standard water pump. We like very hot water and the way to get hot water is to lower the flow. The problem with that is the water pump will start to rapid cycle and this causes the water to exceed the temperature limit and it then blasts you with cold water. My wish is for Girard to replace the standard pump with a pump that you can vary the water flow without the rapid cycling. This should be a improvement for those who dry dock. I am going to give the tankless system one more try this weekend, and if it is still a pain in the behind to work with, then I will have it replaced with a tank model.

I do not know who talked to you but I know the THWH in the house has to have a high flow of water to get real hot water. If you have a low flow it takes a loooong time to get HW. Flow may not be the problem but the HW setting on the heater maybe. We have ours set at 120 which about where it should be.

by jrnert on 4/9/2011, 3:09 am

CO4678....I have not heard from you. I'm sure we can solve your issue if you would contact us. Email me at jrennert@girardrv.com or call 866-559-1221. If you call, please ask for Jerry.

Thanks...

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New Wildcats now have tankless water heater

New Wildcats now have tankless water heater

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