Fitting Mechanical hand brake

Brake conversion.

I have now done my brake conversion. I have used some spacers under the brake handle, (picture1) there is enough clearance to be able to operate it. It is quite simple to use as it is a pull to apply, push to release. The handle moves about 110% to apply the brakes, which is just right for the position I had to install it in (picture 2). The stabilizers just miss the handbrake handle when the landing legs are retracted (picture 3). The guide tube for the bonded cable is also on spacers, so that it would not catch on the under belly of the Cat (picture 3). I was also lucky here as I have used the same fitting position as the stabilizers; this has saved having more holes in the metal work. I bent the guide tube 90% to get the angle from the brake handle to the center of the Cat (picture 4). I also but a slight down ward bend on the end of the guide tube so that the cable gets fed into the center of the pulley on brake handle ratchet, also that it does not get caught on the under belly of the Cat. I have decided to use Bowden cables from the brake drums to a cross member on the chassis of the cat, this way the cables are easier to get into a better position for fitting to the bonded cable from the front of the Cat. They need to be pulled at a central point due to the fact I did not want to use a compensator due to lack of fixing locations. After removing brake drum and back plate there is a slight difference to the way the back plates are made up, the Lippert magnet is smaller area wise, (picture 6) but thicker height wise (picture 7).
The back plates look like they where made in the same factory, as do the shoe’s and leavers. Fitting was very easy about an hour a side including making brake adjustments. (picture ). And checking bearings and grease. One thing I found out when I was testing the electric part of the brakes was that the brake away switch was not always making a good contact, so I just replaced it with my spare. There seems to be very little movement to apply the brakes mechanically, so they should work satisfactory. All I am waiting for now is my Bowden cables so that I can make the final connections and have a mechanical hand brake set up.
I'll post last picture as soon as cable is fitted.
Sean


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GOOD JOB!!!

I sure hope we dont have to do something like that over here in the GOOD OLD U.S. of A....

Although, you wont need chocks anymore.

oldelmer1 wrote:GOOD JOB!!! Although, you wont need chocks anymore.

Agree on the work, but I'm not sure I would give up the security of my chocks; especially on sloping sites.

Sean, do you think one parking brake would hold the camper ?

It looks good so far.

Mopar_Earl wrote:Where did you get the parking brake handle assembly and the cables and such? Was this a kit from Dexter?


Earl

The hand brake was supplied from a 5th wheel supplier over here paid over the top for it but it works. The cable are just standard bonded cable, the cables from the back plates are bowden cables that I modified to fit the brackets I made for the cross member. I have now got all the cables attached now so will post picture later. Pulling the hand brake about 20% applies the brake on the axle so that I can not move the wheel. So I think it should hold its weight with just another 5 to 10% on a hill. I will test on my next week end away, and post results.
Sean

Here is the last picture of the brake cables from the back plate to the brackets I made to link the cables together.
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A ball park figure of the cost was $900.00. now I will be able to say I am legal in the U.K.

Nice job. Jim

Great work, I want one!

Sean, I have read all your post. How many mods have to be made to a FW to be able to use it in the UK? I had a talk with a fisherman in Scotland about four years ago about the requirments for his boat and the differences were amazing. The talk was over a couple of pints so my memory may be hazy :
Greg

The only legal requirement (at the moment) that is due in force in 2012 is the handbrake modification, which I have now done with great results, I don't have to use chocks when I unhitch. Most other things on a FR is border line. One law that was changed in my favour last year was the legal width for caravans and trailers was in creased from 7'6inch to 8 ft . The E.U is also looking into the use of Electric brakes, to see if they comply with the law as it stands at the moment, I am obviously hoping that they do other wise I will have to install Hydraulic or Air brakes.
One thing that I have noticed is the fact that most people with 5th wheels over here are unaware of the Laws that are in force or changing, most do not have a handbrake.
Sean

Hi, Sean! I don't mean to hijack your thread, but I live in Norway, a country which is not a member of the EU, only the EEA, but still seems to follow the EU rules better than most EU countries. I am planning to import a Wildcat 30BHS within 4-5 years (when the last of the kids moves out). The problem is of course the brakes. The 30bhs is below 3500 kilos in gross vehicle veight, and that means that I can drive it in Norway without mandatory air or hydraulic brakes. But electrical brakes are not yet allowed, as you know. So they would have to be converted to mechanical brakes, of the kind that brakes when trigger in the pull bar (or whatever it's called in English) is compressed.

And that's why I registered to this forum, to ask if it's possible to get a fully mechanical brake conversion done cheaper in the US. In Norway that conversion would cost me at least 10 000 dollars! Seriously! And then there's the 3000 for the electrical conversion to 220V (mandatory if you're going to have the trailer registered) and finally the LPG/gas system overhaul (around 1000). So I was thinking that it could be possible to do the brakes cheaper in the US (power and LPG has to be done in Norway, by registered technicians).

And if you think this is expensive, the only vaguely similar trailer I can get in a regular way is the Kabe Hacienda 1000, which is smaller, has no slideouts and has a ridiculous black water tank of around 18 liters (4,8 gallons). A new one would set me back around $100 000, but I have seen them used but still OK looking for around 65 000. Still that's not really an option since I like to be able to do my business for more than a weekend without fearing that the tank will be filled! Also I really like the setup of the 30BHS because it has the master bedroom and the WC in different ends (yeah, I'm a bit self-consciuos about that WC part and prefer to have music on in the bathroom, and with this setup I can do that without waking up my wife if I have to go late).

So I was prepairing to shell out $20 000 for the trailer, 5000 for shipping, 6000 in Norwegian import taxes and VAT and then the conversion, which would about triple the price of the trailer before I got it on Norwegian plates, but it would still be a better buy than the European counterparts. Then I read your message, especially this:

Sean wrote:The E.U is also looking into the use of Electric brakes, to see if they comply with the law as it stands at the moment, I am obviously hoping that they do other wise I will have to install Hydraulic or Air brakes.

Does this mean that there's a real chance electrical brakes will be allowed within the next years? That would be totally fantastic, especially since they're a lot better than the mechanical brakes! Can you pretty please (with sugar and maple syrup on it) give me more information about where you have read/heard about this, and where I can find out more?

I got the information from a 5th wheel dealer, (from more than than one company). I am under the impression that, electric brakes will be allowed. I am still able to use the electric break system because I have now complied with the mechanical hand break, (it is not illegal, not to have a mechanical hand break over here yet, unless something goes wrong. Law changes 2012) Doing a conversion on a 5er to utilize the over run system I would think it is imposable due to the way that the unit couples together.
I will try to gather more info later this week if I get the time and will post all updates that I find.
Also look on Ebay there are dealer over here that import to the U.K. this route could be cheaper for you.The electric system does not need much to modify it to run safely at 220/240 volt AC, I have had mine converted by way of a power converter. This saves have to change all the 110v appliances. Let me know if you need more info and I will do my best to help.
Also to the forum from the UK.
Sean

Thank you very much for answering and the welcome! I guess I should have been clearer, because the one I'm looking at is not a fifth wheel. It's almost impossible to get any fifth wheelers registered in Norway, the only ones I know are older models (from before some year I'm not sure about, when the rules changed) and a few Triple E Topaz. The problem is that one of those Topaz will set you back around $110 000 because of the rebuilt brakes (completely rebuilt for pneumatic brakes in Germany)! Not to mention that I would need a full big rig driver's licence at around 10-15 000 dollars. So I'm droolling over a regular caravan that is light enough for me to drive it on my light truck licence (which you'll need for anything with a gross vehicle veight above 3500 kilos in Norway, and I have been driving Suburbans for almost 15 years). This is the one I have decided on, if I can get it on Norwegian plates:



I would really love it if they allowed electrical brakes in the EU, because then I could legally import one with that to Norway as well since they have to accept anything that's legal in the EU.

In Norway (probably because of the winter and the rather extreme weather we have at times) you're not allowed to run on a converter. You have to get a certified electrician to run all new, certified cables to all the 110 V equipment and put in Norwegian (the regular two prong European style) sockets.

I'm really looking forward to hearing more about electrical brakes! Since I've got a few years (I really want to have it when my last kid moves out in 2016) there is a chance that they'll manage to change the laws and regulations in time!

The mechanical brakes on a Caravan type of trailer is very easy, you could do it yourself if your are slightly mechanically minded. all you would need is a set of 4 back plates for the the axles, a set of bowden cables, a brake cable equalizer, a new hitch that would take the weight of the trailer (Bradley, Knott, Alko) and a break rod to couple it all together.. I would reckon on cost to do this in the U.K. (DIY) about £2000.00.
I,ll do a post on my converter,(later in the week) it is not just a cheap conversion to 230 volts for me and the most important part for me is that it runs at 60hz..
Sean

Another point I nearly forgot is that doing the conversion using Dexter or Lipert back plates you could still have functioning electric breaks, bonus or what
Sean

That sounds interesting. But I remembered something: I need to use Norwegian bought axels that are registered for the correct weight in Norway. That's why it's so expensive. They don't do brake tests for trailers in Norway, so only certain parts are accepted. I think I will have to wait for the electrical brakes in EU. But that I'm very interested in!

Great thread.

Now that you have done this the expensive way (!!) have you figured out where could you get the same parts from state side?? Do you have any better pictures of where the cable connects to the shoes?

This was the cheap way, It cost about £600 I think. The brake back plates and shoes came as a kit I purchased the cable and hand brake leaver over here, it works real good so I am very happy.
Sean

Cool.

600 quid? kin 'ell!!

Any idea where the back plates came from originally? The states?

When I visited the factory I had the chap call lippert to enquire for me about hand brakes but I drew a blank every where I searched!

They came from Dexter's, And then shipped over here. The axles and brakes were Lippert, but Dexter's are a direct replacement.
£600 was not too bad for me as I had been quoted £1000 to do the job by a company over here but all they do is drill a hole in the leading shoe, attach a wire bond which is then attached to a hand brake leaver. This is apparently ok because it does work to a certain degree. But I wanted something that was going to do the job properly.
Sean

Sean wrote:They came from Dexter's, And then shipped over here. The axles and brakes were Lippert, but Dexter's are a direct replacement.
£600 was not too bad for me as I had been quoted £1000 to do the job by a company over here but all they do is drill a hole in the leading shoe, attach a wire bond which is then attached to a hand brake leaver. This is apparently ok because it does work to a certain degree. But I wanted something that was going to do the job properly.
Sean

Great info. Thanks....

Lets face it. I haven't heard of any 5er's rolling away state side (unless I'm mistaken).

A quick bodge like the above would do OK...... and keep the Ministry at bay!

The main thing for doing this conversion was the change in the law that is coming our way [Possibly 2012) where all towed trailers must have a mechanical handbrake.
Sean

WOW

Portagie1968 wrote:WOW

Thats in the U.K.Dan so no need for you to worry.
Sean

Found them!

K23-112-00 - http://dexteraxle.com/inc/sdetail/8450/1488
K23-113-00 - http://dexteraxle.com/inc/sdetail/8450/1489

Not yet but I bet it will be here in the near future. Anything to make our life miserable. Anybody ever hear of 4 chock blocks.