Adding an Outlet

First topic message reminder :

My wife and I own a 2008 32qbbs. We heat the unit via campground shore power. We try use two ceramic heaters front and back to make the rig cozy during the winter camping. Everytime I plug in both heaters, the circuit breaker is popping. I've noticed the fuse box has two openings left without fuses. Can I put in fuses and run a romex wire to another outlet by our rear bedroom? Will the box handle it? Anyone done this modification before?

schrowang wrote:

oldelmer1 wrote:

schrowang wrote:
Also, I bought a 90*/20A male cord cap for the other end of the 12-2 extension cord so that I can close the cover of the park's power center. If you use a standard cord cap the cover doesn't close. The purchase was at an Ace hardware store, so this should be a standard item on their shelves.

Luck .......

Hi Mike,

I went to Lowe's, Home Depot, Ace Hardware, and Do It yourself Hardware looking for the 90*/20 amp male cord cap and couldn't find one. Electrical Supply house was closed.

I did find one that was cheap plastic, but not very water proof and would be afraid to use it outside.

Would you mind taking a picture of yours and posting it. Also is there any numbers on it?

Thanks Mike....

Tom,

I'll try and do that tomorrow. Boy has it been cold here. It just broke freezing today at 34*F with snow flurries all night and all day today. Supposed to be the same tomorrow, but I'll try.

Hi Mike,

I went to another Ace hardware and another local one, Ace had a 15amp indoor plug that wasn't very nice.

I then went to Arrow Electric supply house and they had 3 different kinds, Hospital grade, industrial grade and regular grade. I opted for the industrial grade, a little pricey, $14.53 each. but the are 90* with a 20 amp rating. Here is what it looks like:

http://www.electrical-products.net/items/Gen_Purpose_Wiring_Devices_Plugs_Conn_Inlets_Etc/i21022734_STRAIGHT_BLADE_PLUG.htm

Thanks for your help, if you haven't taken the picture yet, you don't have too.....

I got all my parts today for installing the 20 AMP inlet and new outlets in the camper.

If the weather warms up a little, I'll try to install it this week.

Cold weather's been keeping me out of my Cat; five more inches of snow yesterday and +13 F with wind chill of -2 F today. I could turn the furnace on, but spring is just around the corner. Tom, I hope your weather cooperates sooner rather than later.

TC

Tom,

28*F here in Swannanoa and as I look out the window of the Cat I see 4" of white stuff on the ground. You're probably getting hit just like we are, so it looks like you'll have to postpone the conversion a few days. Tomorrow morning my Cat is gonna look like Shooters in the latest header pix.

Best of luck on the conversion. It should go pretty easy.

Hi Mike,

I was wondering if you had gotten any of this snow. We currently have 4 - 5 inches, although its kind of hard to tell cause the wind is really blowing hard. Of course its drifted in the DRIVEWAY!!! I'll have to get the DW out with a shovel.

How's your CAT making out in the snow? I guess your CG is pretty much empty?

I think the conversion should go just fine, I don't have any problems with wiring anything up. I've wired basements, garages, added new panels, etc, so I'm pretty confident with that.

Update, the sun is out, but its still snowing.....

Anybody convert there Cats from 30 to 50 amps? I have been thinking about this alot. During the summer my micro and AC pop fuzes. Cost would be the stopped I think.

That would be a MAJOR project. Not sure if you'd need heavier wire run or not.

Could your breakers tripping be related to something else other than load?

If you have this problem primarily at a camp site, you might consider installing a Hughes Autoformer. Others on this site have already done this. It prevents low-voltage scenarios that can trip breakers...or worse!

Check this out

TC

The wire going to the main would have to be bigger. Once past the main all the wire is the same. But you are right. A big big project. Low voltage not the problem. We have to make a choice between the AC, Microwave and the electric hot water heater. Trying to get past this.

So Dan, my next question is...are you sure your converter is working properly?

We can run at least the AC and Microwave together. I haven't tried adding the electric water heater element into the mix yet. But you could always keep it on propane when running a bigger 110 load.

Also, have we covered which size of AC unit you have? Is it the 13.5K or the 15K unit? That can make a differenc in overall load capacity.

TC

I went big TC. I got the 15K unit. Wicked Kitty can become a freezer if I want it to. HW goes on propane in summer. In winter the electric with propane back up. Have concerns there but as long as it works do not mess with. I am going to verfy this summer to see if my old tired brain is working correctly but because of the 15K micro pops the curcuit.

Is it possible that your converter is under-sized for the upgrades?

Maybe a different converter would end up being a less expensive route to take.

TC

Might be but everything is 110 so the converter is not involved I would think.

I just ordered my 205EL.OEM ( MARINE INLET 20A) from Burnstines. Was 28.15. Prices have gone up. Will get 2 in a couple of weeks. While I was doing my research I found this item that I also ordered. It is on page 8 at

http://marinco.com/files/PRKPOWER%202008%20CAT.pdf

The part number is 1RPCRV. It is a Right Angle RV Adapter. Burnstines is shipping me one for 38.35. At the bottom of page 9 are some accessories that are nice to have but not necessary.

I have also purchased the right angle Marinco RV 1RPCRV adapter. It works great because I leave my generator connected on road trips so it is always ready for instant power if I dry camp or happen to stop in the dark or want to pre-cool the trailer's A/C an hour or so before stopping. Being a right angle it doesn't hang out inconveniently while driving but rather hangs straight down (without rubbing the trailer wall either).

But it cost me almost $60 at my local RV dealer so your deal is a good one.

Thank you. Nice to here it works.

HELP. I am adding a Marinco 20 Amp Inlet 205EL.OEM soon. I am new at adding outlets to trailers. I need to make a 3 inch hole in the side of the trailer. How do I know were to drill? Are there studs to miss or do I just find a site and drill? How close can I get to the slides when I drill? As you can see I am as green as green can be. Thank you for the help.

Portagie1968 wrote:HELP. I am adding a Marinco 20 Amp Inlet 205EL.OEM soon. I am new at adding outlets to trailers. I need to make a 3 inch hole in the side of the trailer. How do I know were to drill? Are there studs to miss or do I just find a site and drill? How close can I get to the slides when I drill? As you can see I am as green as green can be. Thank you for the help.

Dan,

Take a look t the 5th post on page one. It shows the pix of the install that I did on my 29RLBS. I figured that drilling over the shower box would put me in an area without studs. I was right.

It's not a hard install, but make it easy on yourself. My install put the outlet on the wall under the entertainment center which was about 4' away from the inlet in the outer skin of the Cat. There was also a shallow hollow behind the luan paneling under the entertainment center that made the install pretty easy.

Luck to ya' .....

Dan,

The microwave and the A/C unit each have their own circuit breaker. When you use them together are you tripping their individul breakers or are you tripping the main 30A breaker for the whole coach?

If you're tripping the main it may well be low voltage that's doing it. The lower the voltage the higher the amperage draw on a given circuit.
A heater rated at 1500W would draw 12.5A at 120VAC. (1500/120 = 12.5). The same 1500W heater would draw 14.25A at 105VAC. And the lower the voltage, higher the amperage draw.

Another thing to consider is that your 30A bi-metal breaker is only rated at 85% of full load. So, your 30A breaker will trip when more than 25.5A are put across it.

I don't know what a 15K BTU A/C unit draws, but I'd bet that on a hot day the motor start amperage would exceed the main breaker's rating if other appliances in the rig were working.

The 50A service in our park here in Swannanoa runs on 210VAC single phase power. There are two legs involved, so it's not a simple install to put 50A in the coach. I'd think that at least it would require a new AC panel with a 50A main (210VAC 1Phase) and split wiring to two branches of ciruicuits.

It can be done, but it's gonna be expensive $N,NNN.NN and not something that I'd tackle myself. I'd have a professional electrician do it.

[quote="schrowang"]

Portagie1968 wrote:HELP. I am adding a Marinco 20 Amp Inlet 205EL.OEM soon.

Dan,

Take a look t the 5th post on page one. It shows the pix of the install that I did on my 29RLBS. I figured that drilling over the shower box would put me in an area without studs. I was right.

It's not a hard install, but make it easy on yourself. My install put the outlet on the wall under the entertainment center which was about 4' away from the inlet in the outer skin of the Cat. There was also a shallow hollow behind the luan paneling under the entertainment center that made the install pretty easy.

Luck to ya' .....

My have to consider that. My shower may be below the bathroom window. Have to check that out later today. Thank you for the help. Now to figure out were to put one in the rear of the trailer. That will be fun. Wish me luck.

Dan, When you plug into the 50a service, are you just using the standard 30a cord with an adapter? If so, and keep in mind I am no electrician, I don't think you are getting 85% of 50a. I think the 30a breaker in your camper is still limiting you to 85% of 30a. Then again, I could be completely wrong and would no be surprised if I was.

I use the 30a cord. But, I am getting a full load to draw from. My trailer may deliver only 85% but the power getting to my trailer is 85% of 50 amps. I have been told this is a very good way to go especially with my large AC. Especially since some trailer parks may be a little low on what they provide.

One question.

Where are you guys getting the 85% stuff on thermal magnetic breakers?

MountainMan wrote:One question.

Where are you guys getting the 85% stuff on thermal magnetic breakers?

From a licensed electrician and from the internet. The bi-metal (thermal) breakers that are used in our homes and our trailers will trip at 85% of load. I believe it's also in the NEC part on breakers.

Portagie1968 wrote:I use the 30a cord. But, I am getting a full load to draw from. My trailer may deliver only 85% but the power getting to my trailer is 85% of 50 amps. I have been told this is a very good way to go especially with my large AC. Especially since some trailer parks may be a little low on what they provide.

Dan,

Brad is correct. You may be getting 85% off of the single 50A (42.5A) leg that your tapped into, but the 30A main in your coach will be the limiting factor.

The breakers that are used in your home and trailer are thermal magnetic. Yes, they do have a bi metal strip which is the thermal part and is the long term (heat) tripping mechanism. The magnetic part, of which every single breaker in your home is, acts as a solenoid. The more current that passes through the breaker the harder the pull is on the release mechanism until it trips. It is the instantaneous trip of the breaker.

In a real world application if I have a 30 amp breaker that is tripping out at only 25.5 amps, I will be changing out that breaker. Its no longer holding as it was designed to do. TM Breakers will most often hold at their stamped rating and very often hold for short periods of time slightly more than their stamped rating. I've installed a few thousand circuit breakers over the last 25 years.

As for the 85% ratings by the NEC for TM breakers???

The NEC does state branch circuits should only be loaded to 80% of rated capacity if a continous load. (Continous defined as more than 3 consecutive hours above this 80% if memory serves me.)

schrowang wrote:

Portagie1968 wrote:I use the 30a cord. But, I am getting a full load to draw from. My trailer may deliver only 85% but the power getting to my trailer is 85% of 50 amps. I have been told this is a very good way to go especially with my large AC. Especially since some trailer parks may be a little low on what they provide.

Dan,

Brad is correct. You may be getting 85% off of the single 50A (42.5A) leg that your tapped into, but the 30A main in your coach will be the limiting factor.

That is what I am saying. The trailer limits my power not the Park. I get 100 percent of what I need to the trailer the way I have it setup.